444. - King Tuff

All right, this episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Stateside with Kai and Carter, a new podcast from The Guardian. And they are using this podcast to slow down the news and wrestle with the questions that we all have about what's happening in the world. And they do it three times a week, Jason. Does that sound familiar to you? We don't really talk about, you know, a lot of international global news items and climates and cultures and sports and things like that. We do talk about fashion and wellness, but for everything else, Kai and Carter are a great place. All right, so who couldn't use more news? Listen wherever you get your podcast. or watch on youtube how long gone is it chris black dj them jeans two words not one what's up bro how are you what's up bro oh just another day of grinding and money making manhattan um had to hit the ups had to hit the equinox uh had to hit gmail.com it's been a full day so far as you can imagine wow that's what i do every single day next you're boring me all your errands are pussy i love doing lowly tasks it makes me feel like i'm accomplishing things what happened to money making manhattan chris i want to hear about you doing Power blocking with your outfits on the way to an important meeting? Well, I mean, there'll be more important meetings later in the week, but it's kind of a slow start, as you can imagine, thanks to most people taking Martin Luther King Day off on Monday. So today is kind of a Monday, if you really think about it. Okay, I get it. I don't know if with your DJ and culinary background that you have any friends that have jobs. that kind of have office hours, but maybe I'm the only one. I like that Chris is giving me an education about Martin Luther King Day. No, I'm not giving you an education. Of all the people and of all the days. I'm from Atlanta, Georgia, so it is a very prominent holiday. I don't know anybody who work in a building or office, but I do know some people that work at the DMV and stuff like that, and the national holidays, mailmen, people like that.

Male people. That's a good point. Male carriers. I know because of your hawk-like watching of your... narc ring cam you you probably are pretty close with the mailman at this point uh well i wish i feel like every day there's a different mail carrier so i can't keep tabs on them back in the day you used to tip your mail your mail carrier oh yeah i mean i i actually now i don't know who to give the tip to i wanted to talk about this because it is i've noticed that mail comes at almost all hours of the day like i'll get mail delivered to my house from the u.s postal service at 9 p.m This is not an exaggeration. But there's multiple male people that bring different stuff. Like one guy brings the letters. One guy brings the packages. But I feel like there's four of those people. I feel like I'm talking to Gary Black, not Chris Black. For listeners at home, Gary Black is Chris's dad because this is real old head hours. Back in my day, the mailman used to come at a presentable time. And they didn't have Wu-Tang tattoos on their legs. No, the mailman that delivers sometimes does smell like marijuana and has one AirPod in. So I know he's cool. Yeah, real shit. Yeah, real shit. I watch him sit in the mail truck, blow one down, put his AirPod in, and then just start strolling. I do agree. As much as I am clowning, I have noticed once you get older and... The mail used to come at a certain time every day, and that's just what it was. It never came on a Sunday. And now that the mail comes on a Sunday sometimes with no rhyme or reason, like you said, it'll be Sunday, tropical rainstorm, 9 p.m. I'm getting in the deliveries here. Hey, guys, watch out. I have a case of recess, magnesium, rice-y soda here. I just need somebody to sign for it. Can somebody sign for this adaptogenic nootropic soda, please? It's raining. I have a machine that looks like a Nespresso, but it gives you a joint. Obviously, every person will just be an Amazon delivery person in the near future. So everyone's going to have that job, but for now, it's like... I mean, look, I'm a...

male lover uh and i um i i like the audio of that i like it whether it's coming from ups fedex dhl usps the royal mail i mean i'm a male lover i'll take it shaved hairy I'll take it any way I can get it. A little fat. I'll take a stupid one. I'll take it any way I can get it. So this is something that I do watch closely, and I'm not going to be shamed for it by my co-host. As long as he has a job and still talks to his mama, Chris is down. Yeah, totally. Absolutely, absolutely down. But, yeah, it was a beautiful, cold, but sunny day yesterday. Did a full stroll. Went to C.O. Bigelow. Picked up some important apothecary items. What did you say it's called? Obicolo? C.O. Bigelow. C.O. Bigelow. Okay. As soon as I said it. I thought that was what grandmas used. No. It's an amazing classic New York institution that sells all kinds of great items from toothpaste to hair clips to candles. You name it. It's kind of giving hotel. Yeah. I mean that's. Yeah, I mean, it might be 100 years old, so that's fine. It's like it's the Brooks Brothers of deodorant. Is that what you're saying? They do have hella deodorants on deck, like many deodorants to choose from, which I know. It sounds like a company that like. would be incorporated in 1832. Look, they made their first deliveries on horseback. That might be true, but I can't totally confirm. Have you been getting a lot of good natural sunlight in the mornings to kind of reset your inner circadian rhythm? It's interesting that you ask that because I'm doing my best, but I've been kind of, you know, I don't like to do this, but I've been watching some TV before bed, and another show that I mentioned before has gotten me a little hyped up. God damn it. I know, I know. It's called Southern Hospitality, and it follows a group of nightclub employees at two different locations in Charleston. Isn't this already like 11 shows called Southern Hospitality? You're thinking of Southern Charm. That's the one that kind of put Charleston on the map in the reality TV platform. Okay, there's that one, and then there's a different...

hospitality that you just talked about like a week ago right yeah that's that's a different one that's in the hamptons this is in charleston so it's a little bit more fried because obviously it's it's less sexy because they are live in charleston um but they they work at a club called republic on king street and then also um there's another place called like bubbles or some shit but they um you you can imagine they sell bottles they fuck They fight. They come out of the closet. It's kind of all the stuff you need. But unfortunately, sometimes when I watch these programs before bed, it doesn't help reset my circadian rhythm. Oh, is that right? And I am dealing with that. I am dealing with some issues with that. The booming Bravo network licensed. Kind of Euro techno that's playing. Yes, exactly. It's not keeping you in a zen-like state, ready to drift off to a slumberland. No, I need them to, I need maybe, I'm sure there's someone out there who would like to do this for me, but could you recut Southern Hospitality with all Brian Eno? Kind of just so I could calm down a little bit. Bro, Southern Hospitality, Chop, Not Slop. Exactly. Southern hospitality shop not slopped. Well, this is an idea that I had. It reminds me of an idea that I had. I've probably talked to you about it, and nobody thought it was a good idea. That's right. To say I'm still a dreamer. I'm still such a big dreamer. I think it's really important to do that. Because the movie industry taking a shit, right? When's the last time somebody just bought a movie? You know what I mean? You rent everything. You stream everything. No one's making that money anymore, and people are more and more into kind of DIY creative projects and one-of-a-kind gifts and experiences. You with me so far? Yeah, something kind of that has a human touch to it. Yes. So I want to create a website that has a little kind of built-in proprietary software that's easy for anyone to use where you buy a movie, and it has only the dialogue, no score. Okay.

And then you go onto this website and you score the movie yourself. You add in all the music. It just pulls it from Apple or Spotify or Tidal or whatever. You place it in. You fade it in. You fade it out. And you build basically your ideal soundtrack for an ideal movie. It's like a wedding gift or something like that. I have to say, usually your patented stoner thoughts are useless. I don't know how to monetize. Well, you would pay like 20 bucks. You would buy this film without the music on it. It's just dialogue. And then from there, then you add in the music. I guess it'll be free or whatever. And then you make money two ways, just by buying the film, just by buying Notting Hill, instrumental version. Notting Hill instrumental version. Okay. Notting Hill re-rub. Okay. So let's say you get a cool influencer, filmmaker person, you know what I mean? You get somebody who's in the Ion Pack Discord, and they're in the community, and they're like, hey, I took Old Boy, and I scored it with nothing but... Planes Mistaken for Stars. Okay, wow, this is okay. Whatever it is. Okay, cool. So we've got it. I released it, and it goes to the leaderboard on, you know, themgamesmovies.com. This is a good, okay. And then people can buy it and be like, yo, I want the Nick Cave score of her 2012 or whatever. Okay, so I could do How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days with all orchid. And then just see if other people kind of respond to that. When I said all the songs are available on streaming platforms, maybe not all the early seven inches and demos, but I think most. Okay. All right. All right. This is honestly, this is not them jeans, movies.com. We better go ahead and buy that. Because I don't want to lose that on the domain. Look, whoever wants to fund it, I will let them take a crack at naming it. That's sort of just a working title. If you can do better, good luck. Knock yourself out. Good luck. We both win. This is a good idea, honestly. I think scoring a movie is probably very hard to understand. I think normally you would sit with the director to understand where the music should be. But in this case, you're just kind of left to your own devices.

wild and crazy you know you could hear oh yeah you can hear a morning again kind of breakdown during a romantic scene because that's how you imagine well you gotta you gotta stop referencing hardcore bands that 11 people no but that's what i know about that's the only fun way to do this otherwise you're just a nerd it's i mean this this them jeans movies.com just like podcasting in general uh it's sort of built the nerdom is built into it like no you're right you're right that's a given we're already there There's no such thing as a cool podcaster or a cool user or power user of thenjeansmovies.com. That's not true. Don't come for call her daddy like that. We do have a guest today. A guy I've been following for a long time. You know him as King Tough. His real name is Kyle. So that's probably why he chose a different name. Oh, come on. Kyle's a chill name. Kyle's chill, bro. His new album, Small Town Stardust, is out on Sub Pop very soon. I've been listening to this since 2008. He lives in Vermont, like true freak hours, like talks to the trees, I believe, which I'm interested in getting to the bottom of. He's crunchy as hell, most likely. His beard is probably wizardly and powerful. I think there's going to be a lot of interesting... things to talk about beyond music of course of course we'll talk a little bit about music we our goal of doing this podcast is to get our polaroid on the wall of the sub pop store at the airport in seattle and this is one step closer last time we went in there they kind of They gave us a look of, we went to your sub-pop store at the airport and nobody knew you. They didn't recognize us at the sub-pop store at the airport, and hopefully Kyle can help us kind of get on that wall next to the prepubescent 1975 Polaroid. Let's give them a Zoom. Let's give them a Zoom. All right, this episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Quince. Jason, the temps are warming up. It's getting hot out there. Summer always changes how I get dressed. I need pieces that feel lighter, more breathable. And they're just easy, but still put together. I don't want to look like a slob. That's why I keep coming back to Quince. They focus on high-quality essentials that feel and look amazing. Breathable linen and soft organic cottons. Well-made basics, but without the luxury markups. That rare balance where everything feels elevated.

but still effortless. Yeah, Chris, linen season is here. I wore a linen blazer to dinner a few nights ago in the warm California sun. But, you know, you got that Italy trip coming up this summer and quality European linen pants and shirts. Upgrade that look starting at just $34. You know, if you get a nice linen suit, a little t-shirt underneath it, some chill shoes, you're looking good, but you're staying cool. The inside of your special areas are nice and dry as you turn up with your besties. So elevate that summer wardrobe. Go to quince.com slash how long for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns, even on a nice holiday now available in Canada. That is Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash how long. That'll get you free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince punto com slash how long. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by a new podcast from The Guardian stateside with Kai and Carter. This is covering a lot of our bases, Jason. It's trying to slow down. The news and wrestle with the questions we all have about what's happening in the world. And I know you particularly have quite a lot of questions. A lot of questions. But how often? Because we do this podcast three times a week and that's a sweet spot. How many times do they do? Three times a week. And I have a feeling just based on the platform and these talking points that they're maybe going to be covering different stuff than we do. That's just a guess. The Guardian is not some billionaire owned. They're not afraid to say what they want to say, brother. Yeah, Rupert ain't sniffing around in what journalists Kai Wright and Carter Sherman are up to over there at Stateside. But yeah, listen wherever you get your podcasts. You can watch it on YouTube. It's three times a week. And who couldn't use more news? You know, especially when it's not, you know, from here, let's say. Give it a listen. Give it a listen. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Squarespace. Obviously, Jason, you and I spend a lot of time on the World Wide Web. So do our peers, our listeners, our friends, our colleagues. Obviously. Maybe even your parents if they're freaky. And if you're doing anything in the world, writing, taking pictures. I do topless boxing. You need a website. Exactly. A website that works, that does what it's supposed to do, that allows you to be creative but also business-minded.

Jason, there's one place to go for that, Squarespace. Yeah, Chris, I'm over here. I'm modifying calculators and putting Claude inside of them so you could cheat at school. And I just want a place where I could, you know, have everything all in one place. I can have the SEO tools so those future graduates can find me. And, you know, I'm able to accept, quote, unquote, donations for my services that might be gray area. You know what I mean? And then email campaigns. Hey, I got a new 2.3 version upgrade. Boom, boom, boom. Get the analytics going. Raise some money. Show your investor all of your cool analytics of what's going on. They're going to want to get in early. And we can use Blueprint AI to make your website look as professional as your competition, if not more. So head to squarespace.com slash how long for a free trial. When you're ready to launch, use offer code how long to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or a domain. First of all, where are you right now? Because this looks like a homestead, but I feel like you're in a remote location. I'm in the remote hills of Los Angeles. Okay. All right. So you do live in Glassdale Park then. All right. I was worried. I didn't know how remote it was. Mount Washington. To be exact. That's too remote for me. Yeah. That's too remote for me. Yeah, it's like the Vermont of L.A. Yeah, when we were introducing you, Chris mentioned, did you live in Vermont at one time? That's where I'm from, yeah. Okay. Yeah, I moved to L.A. when I was about 27. I've been here about 13 years. For some reason, I thought you had returned to the motherland for a creative spark. I've been going back there a lot, and I always... I kind of do need to go back there occasionally and recharge my gnome energy. What the fuck do you know about gnomes, Kyle? Dude, what don't I know? Really? We just learned about this. We just learned about this. Yeah, so we did a podcast like a week or two ago with our friend Jack Wagner. I don't know. You might know him. He lives over on the east side kind of.

He has a podcast called Otherworld, which is sort of about paranormal things and gnomes and big feet and all those things. Nice. And we did a good 15, 20 minutes on the world of gnomes. Wow. And it really, I mean, we were laughing, but I know that we also have to respect the gnome because it can control our mind and force us to do their bidding for them, right? They're mischievous as fuck. Okay, so have you ever kind of prayed to a gnome? I think mischievous might be a little underselling their powers. My puppy is mischievous when puppy eat my sock a little bit. Gnomes are like killing people, right? They don't kill. Well, they don't do the killing themselves, but they use their gnome mind control to make a boulder on the top of a hill roll down straight into my Rivian pickup. Everyone's dead. They're like Charles Manson, kind of. Yeah, they're merely a puppet master. But do gnomes, do they have a stronghold on the Vermont region? How could they not? They're around. I had at least one friend who saw one once. Can you tell us, I guess, just like a brief, like, your relationship with the world of gnomery, how it's influenced your process, et cetera, et cetera? As a child. I was obsessed with David the gnome, the cartoon. So I think that's where it all started. Give it up to the D-man for starting this whole shit. I think I've always related to a chubby guy with a beard. That's kind of my vibe. Even as a child, you had a beard. Yes. Yeah, you came out of the womb. They didn't say it's a boy. They said it's a man. They said it's a gnome. It's a weed gnome. Does that mean, okay, he's showing us a gnome tat. Oh, for our listeners at home, he's showing us a gnome tat. And the gnome is so small that he's using a simple mushroom toadstool as kind of a lamppost that he's leaning against in a casual way. I'm asking myself, who does this gnome think he is? Gnomes loiter, too. And I'm big into loitering.

And that gnome is loitering. So you're saying that you relate to gnomes on a lot of levels, but one level is that they just like to kind of chill in places maybe they're not supposed to. Yeah, they just loiter, wait for their friends to show up. What the fuck are we doing, buds? Okay, what's the difference between a gnome and just a troubled teenager? Because it seems like they're kind of the same person. They just hang out in front of a Little Caesars and wait for their shitty friends to show up. That's basically what... basically the vibe okay and that's something that you feel that you identify with personally as well oh yeah i mean my entire teenage life was spent hanging in the parking lot i can relate yeah you know getting into fights or getting into bong rips uh more on the bong side i'm glad i was sitting down were you doing some were you doing some skateboarding uh i i watch the skaters i can't i cannot jump to save my life I can jump like one inch. What we call you in the industry is a ramp tramp, then. If you're just... Hanging around, waiting to get some skater dick at the 7-Eleven in Vermont. That's a whole different ballgame, bro. I didn't know how committed you were. Maybe one of them will crash, and then you can take care of them. A skater nurse. Yeah, a skater nurse. You're sitting in the parking lot, and you're thinking to yourself, you know what? I could fix him. Yeah. I was just a punk. You know, I could ride around. I could roll around on it. And, you know, I was mostly about the fashion of it all. Oh, really? The fashion of skateboarding? You're saying how many crass butt flap patches did you have? I had a crass shirt that is basically just a hole now. It's just a hole? It's a hole. It's a black. You can't see it with the naked eye. Yeah, it just became a hole.

one point then i was just like i'm wearing a hole not a shirt i mean if your crass shirt doesn't look like that then you're a poser and a loser i'm assuming right definitely but i also i did have some butt flaps in my time i don't know if people really know about that i think i think we should explain to our listeners at home who might not be familiar with the butt flap so you know the certain sect of like street punk i would call it you know like the casualties and like the the british bands of the seven late 70s it's it's kind of the the snottier bunch of the real like punk punk looking this ain't this ain't your this ain't your like hot topic little bullshit this is for the real heads the real shit these are the type of people that that think you're a pussy if you wipe your ass after you take a shit that's how dedicated they are Part of the fashion is to have a flap that comes down over your ass. I don't know who started it or why. It kind of looks like some people call it a kilt flap or like kind of looks kilt like. I have a theory. I have a theory that it's kind of the precursor to the double knee trend where it's giving the seat, which is getting a lot of action protection. So the pants last longer. Well, it's kind of where my head goes. Yeah, it's like kind of a loitering device. Sure. Yes, yes. It's a built-in yoga mat that you travel around with strapped to your... I have a question, though, because I was never that punk, so I always just wore regular pants. But how does the flap attach to the pants? That's a great question. I would just sew it on with dental floss, of course. Like you were stitching one of your wounds. So you're telling me that... Okay, you're telling me that you're like 14, and you have a pair of – what kind of pants are they? What kind of punk pants are they? What's the brand? Do you know? Well, back then in the 90s, you could not get tight pants for guys. It was beyond baggy. So you had to make them. So I would just turn the pants – I would just get black jeans that would be huge, and then I would turn them inside out, put them on inside out, kind of cinch the legs with –

and then sew that up. Okay, Tim Gunn. Really tight. And then you would have to put zippers on the bottom of the pants to get your feet through. Okay, so hold on. You're saying these are so tight around your prepubrescent calves that you had to add a YKK zipper to the bottom so that you could get your dog through there. So we're basically running an untilier over there. It's fucking tight. It's very Vivian Westwood. So I was going to say, You get the butt flap, which is kind of like a mud flap on the back of a truck tire maybe, and you would use that to display certain markings, favorite bands that you like, upside down American flag, guy punching a swastika, all the normal good stuff, maybe food not bombs holding a bushel of vegetables. Oh, a classic. But then you were saying like, oh, I just sew it into my pants. In my mind at first, I was like, oh, well, like. What do you do if you want to wear the butt flap with a different pair of pants? Maybe you have to go to church. There's no other pants. And that's what I realized. What do you mean other pants? There's only one pants. Okay. Crust Punk, there's only one pants. I have to say that the Crust Punk community is, you know, sewing isn't an easy skill to learn. I just want to point that out. Like a lot of people don't know how to sew. But this was done out of necessity because, like you said, you couldn't find pants that were tight enough. So you're a mother of invention is what you're saying. Yeah. I mean, you know. Krusty Kyle doesn't want to sew. Krusty Kyle has to sew. You had no choice. I quite like sewing, though. Can you still sew? I can fucking sew the fuck out of something. Wow. Okay. It's just like riding a bike, Chris. So we skipped over, but what patches were on the butt flap? Void? Food Not Bombs? What are we looking at? I definitely had an Os Rotten butt flap. Okay, okay. Classic butt flap, baby. That slipped my mind. I also had a front flap, which is sometimes smaller. Bro. I had a filth front flap. Okay. Oh, yeah, yeah. Okay. Kind of also like over a leopard print pattern. Oh, that's nice. That's nice. Okay.

So you got a leopard print loincloth thing with a filth patch on it. Yes, you get this kind of loincloth. It's like sort of you get this sort of assemblage that's sort of half loincloth, half kilt. So instead of having two pairs of pants, you create a front flap and a back flap to make sure those areas don't blow out, and you can kind of have this one custom. If they blow out, fine. Nobody's the wiser. Let me tell you, in my day, I was king of the blowout. Okay, Chazdine. The entire crotch of my pants would be just a patchwork mosaic. Okay, I've heard something about blowouts, and this is a rumor that I can't confirm, but I've heard this. I work in the fashion industry. This is something that I've been made aware of by other experts, that the reason men's crotches frequently blow out is because no matter how much you shake, a minuscule amount of urine, which is acidic, hits the denim, or in this case, whatever these pants were made of, I'm sure they weren't of a high quality, and then it will kind of burn through, and that's why women don't get blowouts. Well, that's disgusting, but it probably is true. It's kind of the same way that ceviche is made slowly over time, you know? Oh, my God. Yeah, exactly. I didn't... Kyle, I didn't want to tell you that. I don't like saying it myself because it is nasty, but it does feel realistic. It doesn't feel that crazy. The science checks out. It's true. No matter how much you try, some gets through. But in your situation, the blowouts happen because the ferret that was living inside your pants would sort of gnaw at the stitching. Is that safe to say? He had to sleep in there when they were on the train going to Boise. The ferret. Bro, don't act like you didn't own a ferret. I had a mouse. I had a really fat mouse. The mouse's name was Matzah Ball. It was so fat. And eventually a dog, there was like a contractor working on my house and his dog came in and just fucking chomped the motherfucker. No. Oh, God. Someone's not getting a tip.

Isn't it cool that you went from being a guy who owned a mouse and now you are a successful adult functioning member of society? Isn't that cool? That is pretty cool. But, you know, I have one of my recent music videos. I have a rat in it. So, you know, nothing's really changed. Except now you've got a rat crawling all over stacks of money. But it was a Hollywood rat that we had to rent for like $1,200 a day. Who's the rat managers? We've got to get the rat out of here. He's kind of going overtime. We only budgeted two hours for the rat. That was the vibe. When I was in my interesting dressing phase, some might say I'm in it now, but when I was younger and I was into hardcore, our clothes were very big. The pants were big. J-Cos. Exactly, and I would tell my parents, like I would get in these fights, my parents, like, I'll always dress like this. You guys are fucking crazy. I look cool. I'm going to always look like this. Obviously, we don't look like this now. My question to you is what was the moment of transition where you were like, you know what? These pants are a little too tight. The flaps are a little too wounded. Maybe it's time for me to move on to a new look. Kyle, when did you transition? You know, I definitely went through a lot of phases, like the street punk. sort of shifted into more crust punk, which then shifted into more sort of like a hardcore look, but then kind of, I got more into the Smiths and then more into, you know, other shit. And then I went full psychedelic freak folk. Okay. Now this is, is this, is this the dawn of King tough when you went full or is this before? No, dawn of King tough was, was when I was still like in the Smith space, but King tough happened early. And then I kind of put it aside for a while and became freak folk. Then I went back to the King Kong. Okay, when you transitioned into the freak folk, is that sort of like actual folky kind of vibe? It was like an incredible string band and like a Fairport convention and like Ren Rock. I don't know about this at all. Okay, Ren Rock, I believe, and I'm just taking this from context clues, that's Renaissance Fair Rock. Is that what you mean? Yeah! Okay.

Jason, just to be clear, just for all the listeners, I also thank God I'm not aware of this genre of music. Okay. But Kyle, if you would like to bless us with some kind of identifying factors of what makes a Renrock band. So I think the kings and queens of Renrock are Fairport Convention. led by Sandy Denny, who's one of the greatest singers of all time. Oh, okay, okay. I'm familiar with Sandy Denny, the name. She sings on, like, a Led Zeppelin song, like, The Battle of Evermore. That's Sandy Denny. What a kick-ass band name, I've got to say. Fairport Convention? Yeah. Oh, man. Nobody on flute? You got a motherfucker on flute? There's not much flute in their shit, but, you know, the main thing is that their music is inspired. a lot of traditional kind of Irish and British traditional folk music. But then they put the fucking rock and beat on it. So they go Bonham style on the drums, but then they keep it a little picky when it comes to the stringed instruments. Yeah, and just like the songs are about like a fucking king killing some dude that's sleeping with his wife. So the lyrical themes also give kind of... A different era, let's say. Paving the way for maybe a bolt thrower, perhaps. I only know about Bolt Thrower the metal band. What is a bolt thrower? No, that's what I was talking about. Oh, okay. Like that type of sort of fantasy. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Lyrical, you know what I mean? Now, what about this hooked you in? Are you into the lyrical content or the music just spoke to you? I mean... You ever jack off to elf porn? Hell yeah. The answer to that question is yes. I mean, you know, where I'm from, there's a lot of folk music and like bluegrass and traditional type of music. So I grew up with that around a lot. So I am inspired by that kind of music. So it just, you know. Okay, it just clicked for you. No, that makes sense. There definitely is Ren Fairs that happen.

in Vermont a lot, too, also. Now, is that something you would, like, take a chick on a date to when you're younger? Or, like, your parents would take you? I was never, like, the guy that was, like, actually dressing up, being like, Hi there, sir! Would you like a... I'm a grog! Whatever. But I was always kind of a, you know, observer. Okay, sure. But I, you know, I attended. I can't say that... I believe I was forced to go to a Renaissance Fair as a school trip once. But I didn't go by choice. But the only reason people went, and nowadays I'm sure this is even more popular thanks to the advent of the Apple iPhone, is to get the picture of the turkey leg being eaten. And what? I mean, those are not turkeys, let's be honest. What? At Disneyland, those turkey legs cannot be from a turkey. It's too big. What else would it be from? It's got to be Emu or something like that. You heard it here first. We're blowing the doors wide off on this thing. Because a lot of people say a lot of things about the Walt Disney Corporation, but this is the first time I've heard they're serving emu down there in Orlando. That's what I heard. That's what I heard. I got to say, emu has to cost more money than turkey. But yeah, that is the one thing. Do you like eating the turkey leg, Kyle? No, it's disturbing. It's like the meat is like red. I thought it was cool to eat raw meat. You know, like that's what all the – you order a steak and you're like, I want it pink. Yeah, not when it comes to emu. Okay, this is different. Yeah, sure. It's a different – it's kind of different consistency the whole thing. I'm sure it's different. Yeah. Especially if it's farm-raised emu. Oh, God. I hope that emu is grass fucking fed. I tell you what. Kyle, what do you – so – I just didn't really take you as an L.A. guy. I'm a little taken aback that we haven't run into you somewhere because I couldn't. Obviously, you have a signature look that I would remember. Kyle, why hasn't Chris seen you at the West Hollywood Erewhon? Yeah, why aren't you at the— It's so strange that you're not there. I fuck with that. You don't go to Equinox in Glendale. I'm just so confused. I certainly don't go to Equinox, but I would fuck with an Erewhon any day. Okay, okay. I just—now, are you—so you live up—do you live in a remote? Like, are you surrounded by other homes or do you have a lot of land? I am a little set back from the road, but, you know, there's—you can only get so— So much acreage up there?

Yeah. Well, who is he? Eric Warheim? Take it easy, Chris. Until this new album comes out and you kind of are able to relocate to Calabasas where you belong, I guess this will do. Yeah. Yeah, actually, Kyle, I was realizing the L.A. part as well because some of the lyrics in your new single mentioned calling in to coast to coast. Are you talking about the radio show? Yeah. And for some reason that just reminds me of driving around like the Inland Empire. Really? When I listen to Coast to Coast, it's like on tour in the middle of the night in Kansas. Yeah, it's obviously nationally syndicated, but we all have our own Kansas, I guess. Can you guys tell me what Coast to Coast is? I don't know what it is. It's like a, I guess it's a supernatural sort of themed radio show that has been on for years and years. like nationally syndicated am radio show where people call in and it's and it's just like where it's the radio station where all the freaks in america call in and tell you know a story about how a gnome had sex with them or something like that it's kind of like this kind of like this show yeah exactly so is there a lot of similarities there's no music it's just like a classic call in pretty much yeah and then they have like experts that come on and it's it's it's like a weird kind of comforting, folky kind of thing that happens. But I think the guy died recently, right? Yeah, there's a different host now. You should have tried to get that job. I feel like you have a lot of downtime. I think I could do it. I've thought about becoming a ham. You mean like a ham radio guy? Yeah. Oh, I thought you meant a ham like a funny jokester. I'm already that kind of... You're already there. I'm already there. I'm actually kind of shocked that you're not a ham radio enthusiast. Did you ever get into any anarchist cookbook type of activity as a teen? You know, that was the thing to do, but that's too much reading.

The one problem with the anarchist cookbook has the word book in it, right? These motherfuckers want me to learn how to blow stuff up? Like what? I thought I could just put the stuff in the bottle and throw it. This is crazy. It would be a lot easier if there was a YouTube I could watch instead of reading the whole book. But no, you know, I have a dream of being one of them ham guys who's just got like a garage full of weird stuff and he's got like the little like just machines and antennas and whatnot. All right, we were talking a little bit earlier before we started recording, but I wanted to talk about Rick Rubin. You familiar with him? Sure, sure. I feel like you guys might have some similarities in some ways. Bearded juice. Good point. I feel like Kyle might know how to use a mixing board. I'm not sure, but I feel like he probably knows. Yeah, so there's been a lot of, not a lot, but there's been some press and interviews of him lately where people are sort of being like, or they're asking Rick, like, so you notoriously don't know how to use any musical equipment, you have no formal musical training, you don't know how to use a mixing board or anything like that, but you're just there with the vibes and then you drop the sage advice. I'm starting to think that he's sort of becoming like the Bernie Madoff of sick-ass beats. Like, he's sort of, he's like fleecing all of these people because his music doesn't necessarily, like the stuff he produces is not like, number one albums or anything. Do not talk about the Red Hot Chili Peppers in front of Kyle like that. You know that's his favorite band. That's a great example. He produced the new Red Hot Chili Peppers album, which not a single person listened to, right? Did he do the new ones? I think, yeah, yeah. I'm almost positive. I think so, yeah. I do love the Chai Peps. Do you? Oh, yeah. Okay, well, after you entered... I guess after you introduce us to Renrock, we shouldn't be surprised by your wide-ranging taste. Do you guys think that Rick Rubin is actually doing something or bringing something to the table, or is it all just fluff? I think he is. I think he is. I hear the argument that he's just sitting there, but he's been involved with a lot of really good records. Have you listened to Danzig's first record? Have you listened to Slayer? No, of course.

All that stuff, you know, the American stuff back in the day, but that's also 30 years old, you know? Right. But, I mean, Yeezus. Oh, a classic. No, I agree that I think that Rick Rubin – I mean, look, as a known vibes guy myself, I have to respect what he's doing. But I also think that musicians are such – and take no offense, Kyle – like little insecure babies that sometimes – If a guy is just there making you feel good, that's going to get the genius out of you, and that requires more effort and might be more important than a guy who can twiddle the knob. That's what an engineer is for. There's so many different ways to be a producer. There's not one definition of that job, and that is certainly necessary sometimes for certain artists. You do need a vibe person around. change things yeah frank ocean comes to malibu and his his car isn't starting it throws off the whole vibe and rick can kind of get him in the pocket yeah you know i mean he's like bro i'm just saying he's kind of like he's sort of on a little bit of an award tour sure where he's doing talk shows and interviews and he's just kind of like yeah man i ain't doing shit i fucking love it it reminds me that i was just watching an episode of 30 rock and and uh tracy jordan the He's basically, like, his career is in the shitter because people think that he's a good person. They respect him because he won an Oscar for a movie, and he hates it, and he goes on a talk show tour and tries to be the worst person of all time, admits, like, I am making all this shit up, it's all bullshit, and the hosts love him even more. Yeah. And I'm seeing some similarities with Richard Rubin right now. Yeah, I mean, he does seem to be... I've heard some sketchy shit about old Rick. But, you know, to each their own. I think there's also the way it works in production, and we've talked about this a lot on the show, is that once you are the person that people go to, you're just the person people go to. It's like it doesn't even really matter if you're doing it. If a label wants your name on the record, they're going to pay you no matter what the fuck you're doing in there. It doesn't really matter. But how many...

How many unsuccessful albums that you had to pay Rick Rubin however many millions of dollars to produce have to happen before someone's like, eh. I don't know. Ask Jack Antonoff, Jason. Don't ask me. Don't ask me. Fair point. Fair question. Yeah. I mean, I just think that also he's offering such a nice, you know. Look, man, the studio alone sounds pretty good to me. I mean, just being down there. When I interviewed Dave Gahan and he was talking about doing records there, it sounds pretty amazing because they work like a – it's like a nine to five. They were like, yeah, we wake up at the hotel, we have breakfast, we go over there, we finish around 6, and then we're back to the – it's all good, man. I think the pace is nice. What he's offering is nice regardless of the service that's being offered. You know what? I don't really talk – I don't like to talk shit on people that are making things. That must be nice. You know, I just – if people are making music and being creative, I'm into that. It's so much better than just being a fucking shit bird, you know, doing some shit job. That's a good point. And we call that shit job podcasting, and I would like you to kind of say it with your chest next time, Kyle. I agree with that, Kyle. I often catch myself. criticizing people who are creating and i know that everyone creates in their own way and expresses themselves in their own way i guess my argument is i will i will feel sympathy for rick rubin once he actually creates something yeah i do i do want i mean we all want rick's solo album we want to hear that i would love to hear that just him in a in a coaster I would love to hear him playing a child's first lesson on the acoustic. Smoke on the water on his Telecaster? You know. I don't know. Okay, let's switch it up. Let's change gears over here, Kyle. I would say you seem like a kind of, much like Rick Rubin, you seem like a guy who has a pretty stable mood. What do you do to help out?

When your mood kind of goes unstable and you go off the rails a little bit? And you can't say drugs? Orange juice. Please elaborate. I kind of do the same. There comes a point at every night around 8 o'clock where my thirst and my mood become unquenchable that the only thing that can cure it is incredible orange juice. It can't be shit orange juice. It's got to be. Love this. It's got to be the good shit. Maybe this is the, I could not expect a better answer to that question. Okay. Typically orange juice is a morning beverage, right Chris? That's what I was going to say. I think that there's, I couldn't have orange juice at night. I think it would throw off my equilibrium. I don't know. It's weird. It's like, I need like, my mouth just gets like, it just wants like tart freshness that only an orange can provide. All you desire is a perfectly balanced beverage, right? Is that so much to ask? Yes. Okay, so I'm the same way. All through my childhood, if I did not have orange juice in the morning, I got super grumpy, just like a truck driver without his big gulp of coffee, and it really did affect my mood a lot. But nowadays, I sort of like it as a treat every once in a while. I don't drink it every day, especially not at night. But I really like that you mentioned it has to be of a high quality because there's nothing worse than a limp dick, terrible orange juice. It's truly awful. So where are you getting your orange juice? How much money are you spending on OJ every month? Walk me through your game plan. Are you squeezing yourself? Sometimes I squeeze myself. For how long? Listen, I got oranges in the yard occasionally. They pop out. Oh, it's like Christmas, isn't it? No, you know, Whole Foods, they have fresh squeezed at the Pasadena Whole Foods there. How much is that hitting for? Which I'm going to go ahead and say is the best Whole Foods. Pasadena Whole Foods. Have you been to Studio City? Or, sorry, have you been to Burbank? I think I have been to the Burbank. I don't like any Whole Foods that you have to park in a structure. I want a lot. Okay, well.

Maybe Pasadena's not for you. Once you get a structure, it all changes. I don't love the structure. I mean, I have to go to the one in West Hollywood, which is an absolute shit show, but it does have a parking lot. Okay, you go to Pasadena, you get the fresh squeeze, which is, I'm assuming, quite expensive, right? Oh, yeah, it's probably like $15. So you get the big, so you don't buy the single use and kind of meter it out. You buy the big dog. Oh, of course. I need a lot of juice. Yeah, he's not buying grams of weed, bro. He's getting QPs. And let me tell you, once I start chugging that, I don't stop. Yeah, Kyle, this is something I think about all the time. Orange juice is the one beverage of my entire life, childhood into adulthood, where once that flow, you open up your throat after you're done squeezing yourself, you open up that throat, and it just... Keeps going. You never want it to end, and you could easily drink $15 worth of orange juice in one slurp, right? Yes. Are you a coffee guy? Of course. Have you ever mixed the two? Sometimes I'm drinking both at the same time, yes. I have a cup of each, but I never mix them together in one cup, although it sounds intriguing. It sounds nasty, but also intriguing. I would give it a try, like, when you're halfway through, when you're doing your coffee and OJ sidecar, when you're about halfway done with both of them, mix them together, see what happens to you, okay? I like this. See if it awakens any demons or spirits. Well, you've seen the recent Pepsi and milk, you know, thing that's going on, the pilk. Actually, speaking of milks, Kyle, what's your go-to milk? You know, I'm kind of deep in the oat zone. Oh, interesting choice, Kyle. You know, okay, so yesterday in beautiful Manhattan, I went into an unnamed coffee shop that's a large chain but not Starbucks or Blue Bottle, and it ends with town. And I moseyed up to the counter because it was closest to where we're going. I was like,

And they have a sign posted that they've now changed things where oat is the default milk. Now, this is a theory, but it seems like they could be in the pocket of big oat. This seems like a kind of below-the-line deal and under the table. I smell foul play. I smell foul play. It doesn't seem real to me. So, Kyle, you don't mind putting all those poisonous seed oils inside of your beautiful body? Is it poison? I don't know about this part. I don't know about this part. A common argument about oat milk is that there's a lot of oils and artificial products and stabilizers in there. I fucking love oils. Are you kidding me? Damn, you just defeated the whole argument in one beautiful sentence. Like, no, actually, I'm fine. I fucking love oils. I fucking love oils, dude. How do you rebut that? You can't. I do feel like oat imparts the least flavor into whatever, into the coffee. I was always, I mean, the seed oil argument is popping, but I also was under the impression that it was caloric. That's what I've always been told. I also love calories. Okay. So this is really the perfect thing for you. It really hits all the notes. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. This is amazing. I feel like you have a lot of kind of life lessons, philosophies, mindsets, outlooks that people need to absorb to enjoy their life a little bit more. Yeah. I mean, everyone's trying to look young and skinny. I think it's time to look old and fat or just not be afraid of that. Have you thought this your whole life? Yeah. Or just when you got old and fat? I've just always been old and fat. We grew here. You grew here. We flew here. Okay, so you started kind of young on this old and fat thing. Yeah, I mean, you know, I have my moments, but I've accepted that I am.

Santa. I think you might be on to something. You seem pretty comfortable in your own skin, which is always a highly attractive quality. When you say you have your moments, what is something that you're still kind of struggling with that you'd like to improve more in your life? And it can be a Switch game. I mean, the only game I play is Breath of the Wild. That literally sounds like a Renfair band. It is. That is going to be the name of my Renfair. It also sounds like a very expensive dog food. I mean, it should be. So what do you want to improve, Kyle? I mean, nothing. I'm perfect. Okay. We're going to have to talk to our therapist about that. No, I've had love handles my whole life, you know? You came out of the womb with a beard and love handles. Yes. And you don't mean just physical attributes. What about on the inside? Oh, on the inside? I mean, I am incredibly lazy. What do you mean? You put out a record every five, six years? That's so bad. But it's one thing to be lazy, and it's another thing to really... hate that about yourself and want to change it i feel like you're okay with being lazy or you've made peace with it you're right you're right i'm real i am okay with it but what do you mean by what do you mean by lazy like you putter around the house all day or you can't make decisions i don't even putter i don't even i'd love to putter jerry you just sit i just fucking sit and stare sometimes and by sometimes i mean most of the day are we staring at the at the flat screen are we staring at the macbook pro are we just staring at the wall sometimes just wall sometimes squirrel okay okay well sometimes a squirrel i mean the thing the thing about that is you know there's a there's a line of thinking that i agree with it that creative people need to just sit and and be with their thoughts you know yeah that's my that's my excuse whenever anyone asks me what I'm doing. You're like, yeah, what you said. That's it. I had a feeling that might work for you, but is this something that, is there anyone in your life pushing you? Like a manager? Is there anybody that's like, bro, we got to get this shit done? And do you resist that or do you just tell them to leave you alone? Do you have a nasty ass wife or girlfriend that's always ragging on you? You know. Just a raggedy bitch. There's been people in my life that have

They're no longer in your life. They've tried. They've tried. You can try, motherfucker. You can try. I'm just doing my thing. Okay. So is that safe to say you're more of a downer's guy than an upper's guy as it pertains to drug use? I mean, I've never done any drugs aside from weed and shrooms, basically. I do, you know, I'll smoke weed and get fucking crazy. Okay, please elaborate. Yeah, what do you mean by crazy? Mostly within my head. I don't do anything, but I will fucking pace the house like you've never seen. Oh, really? So I go from not... What'd you say? Puttering. I go from barely a putter to a full-blown pace. Okay, and then these... So while you're... pacing around your house feverishly after you hit the one hitter one too many times. In your brain, are you figuring out complex mathematical problems? Are you worried about the future? Are you dwelling on the past? How exactly are you going crazy? All of it at once. And then I start checking the locks on the doors. you know okay wow okay making sure the stove's not on classic stuff okay so some ocd yeah yeah ocd paranoia kind of stuff yeah it's fun is this something that you enjoy is what i was gonna ask you like it yeah i'm into it okay this is i think i think that kind of unlocks the the problem that so many people have with drugs and specifically marijuana is just like oh i get weird and i go to like that place and it's scary and i never want it to happen again And I think people who enjoy it are just like, yeah, sometimes that's going to happen. You can make fun out of it. It can turn into something good, an obstacle to overcome, whatever it is. Sometimes you've got to enjoy that hell that you're in mentally. It's weird. It's weird. I mean, I go through long periods of being totally not doing anything. But then I'll be like, you know what, I'm going to eat a gummy and lose my mind.

I weirdly get addicted to that terrible feeling. So most people are doing drugs because it feels good, and you're like, it feels bad, and I like it. So you're in your own movie, you eat. What's the milligrams on this edible? Ten, probably. I've got to say, based on your music, I would think you'd have a higher dosage, but that's beside the point. You know, I can smoke weed endlessly and nothing happens. But the edible goes right to the source. So you eat the gummy, and then you're like, all right, all right, you son of a bitch, let's see how you get out of this one. It's kind of like a Criss Angel mind freak situation. Yes, yes. You are the mind freak. Do you have any pets up there? None that live in the house. I did have some raccoons that I was feeding a lot, and they got incredibly fat, and then one became rabid. Like literally became rabid? Yeah. Okay. What were you feeding these raccoons so much, Kyle? I mean, they were eating my compost. Okay. But I eventually just gave up on trying to keep them out of it. So you're saying the raccoons were, like most people kind of consider them pests that were fucking with your compost. Congratulations on composting, by the way. That's great. And then you just gave up and they became sort of pet-like to you because you were feeding them. So they kept coming back. Yeah, well, they're cute as hell. Yeah, they're cute, but they're toxic. They're insane, dude. And so then one time, I look out the window in the morning, and this guy is up there in the damn tree, a raccoon. He's acting real weird, licking his paws. He's sitting up on top of a tree, and there was a crow in the tree adjacent to him. The crow was just... screaming at him like, bro, what are you doing up there in the middle of the day? The crow knew something was wrong, and eventually the raccoon jumped down from the tree and charged at my brother, who luckily escaped into his studio. So like a literal rabid attack. And then two days later, the guy was just stiff as a board in the yard.

How close did you get with him? RIP to a real one. Yeah, did you name him or anything? I think that one's name was Chauncey. I think that was Chauncey. You named both of them. You had two, you say? There was a lot of them. This seems bad. I'm worried about you up there a little bit. Really? I don't want to lose you. I think you have a lot left to give, and I don't want you to have to lose a leg or something because you get attacked by a raccoon. Yeah. You're probably right. You got any guns up there? No. Next question. Because I don't believe you, but I also... I got a saxophone. I mean, I don't know if you can play it, but a saxophone played wrong could scare away rabid animals. That's for sure. I play every year at New Year's. I get out on the porch and I play Auld Lang Syne on the saxophone, but it's really not well done. So you can or can't play the saxophone? That's debatable. I think you could play it all right, but after... I can make notes come out, but they're not necessarily in the right order. After you've been tying one on on a New Year's Eve, you're probably not going to have the best chops at the moment. Yeah. That seems like a good New Year's Eve tradition, go out on the porch. I mean, I'd like to imagine you just wearing your underpants only, maybe, and just blasting on that saxophone. Yeah, you know, you've got to have traditions. Sure. I'll be really clear. Cannot play the saxophone. But you own one because you're a professional musician and somebody left it? I had big dreams. Oh, okay. So like a child, you bought this, like I'm going to learn it, and then you lost interest. Yeah. Let me be clear. I cannot play the saxophone. Has that happened with any other instruments in your career where you've like, you know what, this glockenspiel is going to be my bitch, and then it kind of sits in the corner? No, I fucking own a Glockenspiel. I own one and I own it. Nobody's surprised at this information, I'm assuming. I can slay a Glockenspiel. Are you getting called into sessions to be the kind of ringer on the Glock? You're the Glock boy. Glock is kind of my first instrument, actually. Yeah, me too. That's also, yeah, that's also...

That's surprising, but also not surprising, I guess. It just seems like a very underappreciated and underrepresented instrument. Yeah, it hasn't had many moments. Probably its biggest moment is Sunday Morning by Velvet Underground. That's cool, but it's not big enough. I know what you mean. That's not blasting out of every car and home in America. Great tune, though. It will be someday. It's no Sunday Morning by No Doubt, but it's a pretty good one. I'm not sure I know. No doubt. Sunday morning. Come on, bro. In my humble opinion, it's Tragic Kingdom's best song. You want to talk about drum fills? I must know. But what about fucking spiderwebs? Is that not on Tragic Kingdom? It is on there. You're saying it's better than spiderwebs? I'm saying spiderwebs is for boys. Sunday morning is for men. Kyle, I know you've never listened to this show before, but when the world... Jason likes to zag. He's a real contrarian. I'm getting that feeling. I do things a little differently around here. I like it. You seem cut from the same cloth a little bit. You kind of do your own thing. I guess so. I'm not really trying to, but it just sort of happens that way. Some of us are natural born freaks and thank God that you have music to kind of keep you on the straight and narrow. Yeah, it's true. Where would you be? You'd be out there laying around with raccoons. You know, when I was young, I had this great idea that I wanted to have this sort of business that was a combination massage slash dessert business. I was a young romantic. Okay, what kind of massage and what kind of dessert? I don't think I ever got that far with the... thinking of it you probably were more thinking about the desserts than the you were too young to understand the different disciplines of massage thai swedish etc yeah you were more focused on massage feel good me like ice cream sundae right yeah yeah okay and this is before you even knew what marijuana was yeah and this is probably it was this before you knew what a handjob was his mind oh yes long long before this is this is a

This is very pure, and I honestly think this idea has some legs now. I mean, who wouldn't want to dive into a nice, fresh sorbet after getting an hour-and-a-half shiatsu? Yeah, but if you – okay, so here's – we have to think about this, Kyle, okay? If you want to know anything about business, you can't just have an idea. You have to execute it. So we're in the massage table, and your little head's poking through that hole. And then you have a little gnome laying on the floor. And he's got that airplane and the airplane goes into your mouth. Is that kind of what you're envisioning? Yes. Yes. That film is feeding you from underneath the massage table. Is that what you're saying? That's right. I mean, how long gone? We make dreams come true. So this is kind of this is a freebie. You know, this is a thank you for you doing our show. We want to leave you with some kind of business advice. Gnome Spa. Gnome Spa. You've heard of We Spa. And also, for the culinary angle, it sounds like no-ma. That's gone. Gnome spa. It rolls right off the tongue. All right. Chris and I are in for 10. We're in for 10 each. That's 20 total. You're probably going to need another 150, but you can figure that out. Oh, yeah. You've got friends in high places. You can go back to Vermont and go door to door. I know Ben. I know Jerry. Kyle, it's been a pleasure having you on How Long Gone Today. Thank you. Oh, thank you so much for having me. Thank you for joining us. The hour just flew by with Kyle. Flew by. And Kyle, the new album, Small Town Stardust, there's like three or four songs out now, but when does it fully come out? On the 27th, like in a week, week and a half. And then are you hitting the road? I'm not hitting the road until March, but then, yeah, full U.S. tour in March. Wait for that snow to melt. I like it. Oh, yeah. We'll come check you out. We'll come check you out. All right. Wonderful. Thank you, Kyle. And we will talk to you soon. All right. Thank you. Have a good day. God bless.